Entretien/Gaspar Noé/Les Inrockuptibles
The violence of certain scenes in Irreversible is bound to spark controversy. It would be a shame if a sociological or moral debate overshadowed the talent of Gaspar Noé, who tests the limits of his art while courageously confronting the darker aspects of humanity. The filmmaker and his two lead actors, Monica Bellucci and Vincent Cassel, answered the same key questions separately.
Vincent Cassel : "This information is one of the most important elements in the film project. The adventure began with this, with Gaspar's desire to use this element that rings true, to use an aspect of our private lives to make this story even more relatable and more horrifying.
It undoubtedly influenced our acting. There's no other actress, of course, with whom I could act in such an intimate way. It gave our performances more strength and truth, but it also reinforces the credibility of our on-screen couple in the audience's minds, since they're aware of our real-life relationship. This blend of reality and fiction was Gaspar's goal; he's a filmmaker with a knack for unsettling the audience. He likes it when people are no longer quite sure what's real and what's fictional. Three-quarters of the characters in the film are exactly who they are in the film: the drug dealers are real dealers, the addicts are addicts, the transvestites are transvestites, and so on."
Monica Bellucci :"From an acting perspective, the intimate scenes were easier because we know each other well, because we have a strong connection as a couple. We found inspiration in our reality as a couple, but at the same time, it's acting, it's fiction. So, we never felt like our intimacy was being invaded. We used our real lives to portray something unreal. Would the film have been different, less powerful, with another actor? It's hard to say. The rape scene is very violent, very intimate, and yet I acted it out with someone I didn't know. A film is a whole package; you never know exactly why you're interested in a particular film or not. I don't believe it's the actors who draw people to the cinema; I believe it's the story. Films with unknowns do well, others with stars don't. When you make Irreversible , a tough film, you know very well that you won't get the box office numbers of Asterix , you do it for the love of making a film with a talented director like Gaspar."
Gaspar Noé :"It gave strength to their performance. Two people kissing who don't like each other, it shows on screen. But when they kiss, laugh, and tickle each other, you can clearly see they're genuinely having fun. What you see on screen and what you feel is what was happening on set.
Without them, the film wouldn't exist. Irreversible came about through this collective desire to make a film together last year. It was May, they were available at the end of July, and in August, so was I, and that was it. I never would have been able to make this film with two other actors. There was also the advantage of their celebrity, which helped secure the film's financing. The financing was in place before I'd even delivered a single page of the script. You hear about things like that in relation to Godard, it's inspiring, and then, well, it happened. I don't know if it will ever happen again in my life."
LIMITS IN THE REPRESENTATION OF VIOLENCE
Vincent Cassel :"I don't yet know my limits. If I had to play a violent person confronting something I don't want to destroy in real life, that might pose a problem for me. In this film, I knew perfectly well that one of Gaspar's goals was to make things as unbearable as possible. I didn't feel close to my limits in terms of violence in this film. What Monica and Joe Prestia do (the rape scene, ed.) must have been much more difficult in terms of acting. I run after a guy shouting his name, I slap a transvestite, in short, I don't do anything extremely violent or problematic. It was much more difficult for me to do the intimate scene in the apartment: we were naked, in front of the crew… With this system of such long and repeated takes, there comes a point where you no longer know if you're acting or not. Gaspar insisted on this and got his way: they had to forget the camera, and everything sounded more real. Getting to completely relax during the intimate scene still took two or three takes."
Monica Bellucci :"When I start a film, I never ask myself about limits. If I did, I'd be limiting myself from the very beginning. I like to be free in my mind when I commit to a film, and above all, everything rests on the trust I have in the director. Making a film like this means we had complete faith in Gaspar's talent."
Gaspar Noé :"The representation of violence depends on the subject matter. If I ever make a comedy or a mainstream film, we'll see… In this case, we set out to make a film about rape and revenge. Ultimately, the limitations stem from the fact that, whatever we do, people know perfectly well it's just a film. Even if some scenes are impressive on screen, not a single viewer is unaware that it's all staged, that everything is simulated. The limit is the audience's awareness that they're not watching a documentary. The limit is how far each person is willing to identify with it. I stand by this film because I find elements in it that have affected me and made me think in other films like Straw Dogs or Deliverance . Even though these films depict nightmares, they served as points of reference for me in the jungle of reality."
THE RAPE SCENE
Vincent Cassel :"You should know that this film went through several stages; we changed the subject three times in one month. The main reason for this film is that we wanted to work together. The first idea was a love story with explicit depictions of sex scenes: we quickly realized that we weren't capable of doing it, that we didn't want to show that side of ourselves. Finally, when we got to this rape scene, it was easier to accept than the explicit sex scenes. It was almost a relief! Monica was the one directly involved. At first, I wanted to come to the set, but in the end, I didn't. First, Monica asked me not to come, and then my presence would have been unbearable for the actor playing the rapist, Joe Prestia. When I saw the scene in the rushes, I watched it because I had nothing else to do, but it certainly wasn't a pleasant experience for me. After seeing the scene, I was a little worried, especially since I couldn't reach her by phone right away… I have to say, it was all a bit unsettling. But at the same time, I think it's incredible that she managed to pull off that scene, and I'm very proud of her."
Monica Bellucci :"I never doubted that scene. I felt we had created something real and very powerful. When I watched the scene again, I realized it bothered me. Even though I knew it was acting, fiction, I had trouble watching it. I then thought, "We did a good job." I think Gaspar handled that scene with great restraint, because it's anything but voyeuristic."
Gaspar Noé :"For the rape scene, the idea was to revisit all the films containing traumatic rape scenes: Deliverance ,Straw Dogs ,Salò … The same went for the fight scenes. There are many in which the fights aren't at all believable. For the rape scene, it was Monica who set the bar, who decided how far the sequence should go to be realistic. My request was that it last as long as possible to be as credible as possible; from there, I followed her with the camera. The assault was in their hands."
MONICA BELLUCCI, BEFORE AND AFTER THE FILM
Vincent Cassel :"Monica has known for a long time that she can play very powerful roles. Someone who has the courage to play a scene like the rape scene, it gives her a serious, believable, and credible dimension in people's minds. Because of that, the public is likely to perceive her differently, to crack the veneer of the glamorous icon that was her image until now. Now, I don't think it was specifically in that scene that she really learned something; I think it was in the whole film. It scared her at first; she wanted to fix things, and I told her, "No, don't fix anything, on the contrary, let yourself go, look, you're great, funny, it flows naturally, etc." She acquired that freedom because she had neither the time nor the material to "work" on it, and that was the big difference for her compared to her previous films. Monica didn't do any scenes. When you've never taken acting classes, you're used to playing very fragmented things that only last the length of a single shot in a film. There, all of a sudden, thanks to the length of the sequence shots and the need to improvise, she was in a zone she didn't know."
Monica Bellucci :"This film changed a lot of things for me. When I started, I was very eager because I knew and appreciated Gaspar's work. But I was also afraid because of the improvisation: I'd never done that before, especially in a language that isn't my own… And above all, we started shooting with only fifteen pages of synopsis; we didn't even have a script. There were twenty-minute takes non-stop; it was like acting in a play, which I'd never done before. It was a completely different way of working for me; it was a real discovery, and I didn't even know if I'd be up to it. So I had a lot of fears, but the challenge of the film excited me, and today I'm very glad I did it. Even though I'm aware of the risks involved in such a film. In Cannes, it's going to be love and hate: some people will shout about genius, others will scream that such films should be banned."
Gaspar Noé :"We'll have to wait for the reactions to the film to see if Monica's status has changed. But I don't think anyone had ever asked her to do anything like that before. The whole crew was amazed, fascinated by what she brought to the film. I'm not a director who's controlling with actors. I prefer to accept people for who they are and try to get them going on set so they can be funny, aggressive, and so on. In Monica's case, she has a striking charisma; but often, in films where she's made up, where she's given very specific lines, I felt she was being held back from who she is in real life. Since the dialogue wasn't pre-written, it allowed her to exist in front of the camera. The same goes for the other actors. I can't imagine micromanaging actors by telling them, "Say this, move like that," and so on. That kind of approach often does them harm. Monica's best quality in the film is that of her real life. But on set, no one really thought she could be so radical, take ownership of the film. I think no other French actress could have been as strong as her."
THE MEANING OF THE FILM
Vincent Cassel :"Watching the film, you get the impression you're looking at a bunch of bacteria under a microscope. I think the point is something like, "We're all pretty horrible animals, and whatever our attitude, our upbringing, etc., when we start having real problems, all the horror inside us is unleashed." The film's observation is that, in some way, we're all more or less like that. When I hear people say, "This film is racist, homophobic, misogynistic," I say, "Yes, of course! Just like you! Just like all of us." Gaspar's point of view, which is very pessimistic, is that we're all horrors, and he's not interested in filming anything until the veneer of civilization cracks and our true human nature is revealed. I obviously don't wish the situations in the film on anyone, but honestly, if something like that happened to me, I have no idea how I would react. After the first day of filming, I started freaking out, thinking, "Damn, I have to make this character at least somewhat likeable." Very quickly, I realized it was completely pointless. The characters had to react like animals to very animalistic situations, and there was no point in the actors trying to inject poetry into that. It was Gaspar's role to bring poetry to the whole thing, not ours."
Monica Bellucci :"This film is disturbing because it shows the monsters within us. It reveals the monstrous side of humanity. There are people like that, who believe that violence is fought with violence. We can be afraid of these people, but we must look at them. It's also the story of three human beings trying to understand life. We must keep in mind the subway scene, when they talk about sex, as if they were trying to control life. But life cannot be controlled; it is greater than us and sometimes crushes us. That's human destiny. Life is a magnificent thing, but also sometimes very cruel. I think this film tells all of that: human beings, victims of something beyond their control. Irreversible reminds me of Kubrick, of Pasolini's Salò , films that show human cruelty. Gaspar is a true, uncompromising filmmaker who doesn't accept compromises: that's why I have respect and esteem for him."
Gaspar Noé :"Other titles considered for the film were at one point *Time Destroys Everything *, then *Vivarium *… The film has this laboratory experiment feel to it, where animals are agitated and don't quite understand what's happening to them. Regarding * Straw Dogs *, it was written that Dustin Hoffman reverted to his animal state after his wife was raped. In *Irreversible* , it would be more that people are animals who control themselves to survive in a civilized environment, and not the other way around ."
Par Serge Kaganski
Publié le 15 mai 2002